EMF exposure & your kid's digital device: Heads up mom!

Episode 93:

EMF radiation exposure & our kids' digital devices is the topic of this interview with Defendershield founder, Dan DeBaun. Tune in to hear his top tips and tools!

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Full Transcription: 

Speaker 1 (00:00):

So the topic of my podcast is often about how to help you be proactive as a mom when giving your kids digital things and helping to guide them in that world. That is what the podcast is founded on and what it's all about. Well, today's episode, we are going to go into another realm of this whole thing around the digital stuff that I've never dived into before. And I'm so excited to bring you an expert in this field to help you get on the top of this too. All right. So stay tuned.

Speaker 2 (00:36):

Welcome to your source for tips, tools, and support to help you be that mom that is tuned in and proactive for yourself, your family, and for the wild ride of raising kids in this digital age, inspired by a mother's love with a relatable real life. Proud to be that mom flare. This is the be that mom movement with your host, Dolly Denson.

Speaker 1 (01:00):

Hey friends, did you hear there is an app that will transform the safety of your kids' smartphone and technology use. It is my favorite way to sleep easy at night and have peace of mind because it is monitoring my kids' activity online without me being in their business. It is the bark app and yes, bark like a dog bark bark bark. It tells you when there's something that you need to be concerned about. Start at a small fee each month. You can protect your whole family across all devices. Get connected with bark today. Use code, be that mom for 20% off your subscription for life and get a seven day free trial to check it out. Okay. So today I am so excited to bring you an interview or a conversation that I had with an expert in the field, around the exposure of our kids, to what our devices are putting off.

Speaker 1 (01:51):

I'm talking about how they communicate with the world and get all of their information that has to come from somewhere. And when it is collecting information, we are inadvertently being expos to electromagnetic frequency radiation. So today I am talking to the founder of defender shield. His name is Daniel Debaun, and he is an internationally recognized expert in EMF, radiation, EMF, shielding, and EMF related health issues with a special focus on the effect of exposure from mobile devices, such as laptops, tablets, and cell phones. His concern regarding the health impact of EMF emissions grew from over 30 years of engineering experience in telecommunications industry, he has had a variety of executive positions in multiple large businesses, such at and T and bell labs in various other things. He's been the co-author of a book called radiation nation, the fallout of modern technology. And he is the CEO of defender shield, which is the world leader in EMF radiation protection solutions.

Speaker 1 (03:00):

So I'm so very excited to invite him onto the podcast today. He shares so much valuable information to help you take these nuggets and use them for your kids. Like seriously, make sure you listen to this entire interview and in our convers, and at the end, he gives some very useful nuggets, very useful tips that you can take today to help make sure that your kid is minimizing their exposure to the things that our devices are inadvertently putting out, whether we are aware of it or not. Okay. I hope you find this so very valuable. I absolutely did, and I am so very excited to bring it to you. So stay tuned. All

Speaker 3 (03:45):

Right. So I am so excited today to be talking to Dan with defender shield, and I am really kind of amazed that I have not explored this topic on my podcast yet, and it's very important. So I'm have you here today. Dan, tell me a little bit about yourself and what brought you to this space.

Speaker 4 (04:04):

Well, Dolly, thanks so much for inviting me. I'm excited to chat with your, uh, your listening audience, uh, about a subject that's really fairly controversial and really understood. And so we have an opportunity today to sort of chat about that, to help people understand this space. I started in telecommunications 30, 40 years ago. I, I actually wrote the technical standards and, and did the testing on telecommunications equipment for years and years and years. So about 10 years or so, 15, maybe close to 15. Now my sons were visiting me. They had their laptops on their, my wife says that can't be good for you. I want grandchildren. And she was implying that there was an emission coming from a, from a laptop that, that, um, affected the male sperm. Um, and I said, look, I've been doing this stuff for many, many years. There's no way the power levels are gonna have any sort of impact to the human body.

Speaker 4 (05:05):

But then I thought about it a tiny bit. I had never looked at the research side of, uh, the medical research side about these kind of exposures. And even back then, Dolly, it was true that after three or four hours, it's potentially true up to 25 per center of the mill sperm became became immobile. So we, we knew from that study work, that it, it actually can affect you. And then of course, other data that I was stumbling, of course, stuff I've never looked at before seemed to verify that there are potential concerns that we should have as parents and users of these technologies. I built a laptop shield for my sons, cuz I'm actually a mechanical engineer. Although I'm an industry, I spent an electrical world and I built a shielding device for my kids. And um, by the way, Dolly, I, I still don't have grandchildren, but uh, <laugh>, that was the whole purpose of starting this journey. <laugh> so that's how I got started. And, and, and once I had a device to protect, I started building other devices that were sort of using the same technology I had and then, and my son and I wrote a book radiation and the purpose of it was so people could read it and, and sort of make decisions about, about this controversial space themselves. So that's actually how I got started.

Speaker 3 (06:30):

Uh, it's really interesting. And isn't it crazy that it's kind of like we won't have anything on our radar until someone makes a comment or, or, you know, just kind of spikes your interest on something and then it takes you down a rabbit hole of exploring that a little bit. Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 (06:43):

I mean, I used to worry about electronics interfering with electronics. I never worried about electronics interfering with the human body, but after my wife's comment, she had an intuition which is actually pretty accurate and it did start a journey that, uh, didn't intend, but certainly have embraced over the last 10 years.

Speaker 3 (07:03):

Yeah. Yeah. Wow. That's amazing. So your book is called radiation nation. The fallout of modern technology is that like on Amazon Barnes and noble, those type of places.

Speaker 4 (07:12):

Yeah. Amazon it's like one of the best sells on Amazon. Uh, it's like interesting how, you know, um, there this, he hemp up interest in trying to understand this space and we wrote the book that, that, that was really intended to try to let people understand what it is, what science says, so they can make their own choices and, and it's been fairly successful fortunately for us.

Speaker 3 (07:39):

That's awesome. So kind of to, as a baseline, just if you can explain, like in layman's terms, what, like, for someone, you know, I hear things about 5g and I'm like, is that 5g in my phone? Is it 5g someplace else? Like just an understanding for the general public, what should we know about like EMF, electro magnetic, frequency, radiation, and 5g and all of that.

Speaker 4 (08:04):

Okay. So my wife was commenting on the laptop that my sons were using and it was the wifi. It's the connection to the router. That is a transmitter and it is being transmitted from the, a laptop to the router. And it's a power, there's a certain amount of power being trans. You can't see it, you can't smell it, you can't touch it, but it's actually there and it's making a connection. And, and so when you have a device like that, what it transmits out of the device in all directions within that room and keeps on going into the other rooms, those can go up to almost 2000 feet. It's fairly, they can go fairly far and it's called an omnidirectional signal. It goes every way you are using it. Well, that's true for, uh, cell phones, tablets, anything that's using Bluetooth, wifi or cell tower connections are transmitting power with a cell phone.

Speaker 4 (09:07):

You have the generations of cell phones, the first, second, third, and fourth generation. And then as you pointed out, you have a fifth generation, the fourth generation up to the fourth generation, those signals that you use for your cell phone, they can go actually up to five miles. So there's enough power to get five miles and it's going in all directions. And, and so that's the fundamental characteristics of technology today, and we're putting it very, very close to our body. And then here comes 5g, which is fifth generation next generation technology, which what's really interesting about that. Dotty, it's not introducing a lot of it is not introducing new connections from a cell phone to a cell tower. A lot of it are all what's referred to as sub gigahertz. It's like the speeds are not that fast. Uh, but, uh, uh, the speed of the frequency rate is, is around one gigahertz.

Speaker 4 (10:08):

It's, it's a, a, um, a wave that moves in the air and, and it's moving at a rate of one gigahertz, um, roughly, um, three feet in milliseconds and it gets to the cell tower with 5g. The other part, which is really the more controversial part of it is that there's new rates that are being introduced much, much higher speeds. And that's where science is getting pretty concerned because we've never had these really, really, really fair speeds in our environment. And that's really what you hear about in the controversial space. Most of what you have in the 5g today is not out there is, is the stuff we've seen all along is coming out of our cell phones, no different than it has been in the past, but it's when it's the small cell site, the, the cell tower right in front of your house, that's about 15 feet high or less. And it's transmitting at much, much higher, fast 23, giggers, uh, 60 gig it's 90 gigahertz. They're really, really fast rates. And that's where the controversial lies that is producing broadband services to the house at speeds, UN uh, haven't been available in the marketplace and now is, and that's where the controversial lies.

Speaker 3 (11:33):

Okay. Wow. So that's interesting. That makes it makes sense more. So what are the, you mentioned the thing about the sperm count, what are the health effects and the things that are known

Speaker 4 (11:43):

Over? So it varies substantially some research scientists that do the work, talk about the danger potentially can lead to, uh, cell damage D DNA damage cell damage, and Dr. Powell, for example, or Paul, however you wanna announce it. He talks about the cell breaking down and becoming potentially a tumor or a non-cancerous or cancerous tumor. That is the been reinforced by study work for the national toxicity program, which is the federal government study coup several years ago, with 25 million they spent, and they found that the epidemiology study that found frontal lobe cancer and heart cancers related to ex exposures, statistically significant changes. In other words, the populations were big enough that we could conclude from the epidemiology study, that there could potentially be that danger with that kind of exposure valley. Those are the, uh, those are the most extreme, uh, and, and are not the things so much.

Speaker 4 (12:56):

We find in the human body with kind of exposures every day. However, something like 20% of us or so were actually impacted in very different ways. There could be neurological impacts, physiological tingling, a of the eyes, uh, ring, uh, the tinnitus, the ringing in the ears. You may be tired, depressed, fatigued. You may have memory loss. So these are varying degrees of exposure, which influences the, the body. And in fact, some argue like in the classroom, there's so much wifi in the classroom today that it it's like millions of, um, of times more than it was 50 years ago. And, and that constant increased invisible power level in the classroom is, uh, potentially impacting, uh, our kids. Uh, um, and so that's the controversy you hear about that is the power that's found within the classroom. Now that's a constant seven, eight hours that they're exposed and there's, you know, maybe depression, anxiety, stress of independent of the schoolwork that's itself.

Speaker 4 (14:12):

And, and so there's that kind of thing that impact the human and, and by the way, do believe it or not, it's, it's like more women than men, which science has not been able to, to, uh, define why, but we know that roughly 20% of the human is impacted by the exposures to cell phones and laptops and wifis. And it, it it's, um, a growing component because maybe our environment is growing and, and of that 80% of women that are affected, you know, you may have a headache, uh, all day. And, um, that's because it could be true. You're sitting next to a router all day. So all of a sudden these technologies we have around us, you just have to be aware of those things around you and the potential influences that may have on, on, on you and your kids.

Speaker 3 (15:08):

So it's not like, um, I mean, it's just kind of like most other things like in moderation and being aware.

Speaker 4 (15:15):

Yeah. I it's like the world health organization who considers, uh, RF signal the signal from a cell phone to the cell tower as a two B carcinogenic. That, that means that it's a potential cancer. So it's not like the world's avoiding it. They're beginning to understand it. And many argue that it'll become a probable carcinogenic the next round with the hook. So it's not like nothing's happening, but it is a controversial space. And it's more are our environment today. And, and 20% of you are influenced, uh, in a negative way.

Speaker 3 (15:58):

So interesting and something we just so much need to be aware of as they ramp up the power of our phones and all of that, all you, you know, like before I was aware of all of this, I would just think, oh, wow, a faster phone, you know, remember this and stuff like that. Like, yeah,

Speaker 4 (16:14):

We're, you know, AEC actually dial, that's a really, really good point. We've had electronics around us for long, long amounts of time. But think of this as only the last five, 10 years, we have all this electronic stuff, you in our pockets, you know, you had a mainframe computer down drive a hundred feet in a building you had that had huge power levels of exposure. It didn't matter because I wasn't in the room now that is in my computer, on my laptop, same power levels, same computing capacity, and it's sitting on my lap. So it, it is, that's why it's sort of, of our, our technology. Our environment is changing along with the technology exposures there's potential impacts to the world health organization. I, I mentioned it's a, a possible carcinogenic. Uh, so is gas when you smell gas, that odor it's a, um, is so an organic material smell and that's considered a two B Cogenic as well. So if you have a wifi in your room and you have a, a gasoline 55 gallon drum gasoline open and spewing the volatile organic compounds into the room, there are equivalent in terms of what the world health organization defines.

Speaker 3 (17:35):

So really it's just about being aware of it, being an influence, and then being able to kind of have it in moderation and not, you know, always have it, you know, like on your chest or in your pocket or on your lap, that type. So

Speaker 4 (17:49):

Absolutely does. In fact, giving you a description of it, what would you do? You'd put a top on it and you take the gasoline and you put it in the other room. That's what you'd do. And the same thing with a router. Uh, you, you don't need it in the same room as you are. All you gotta do is figure out what room it can be in. That's relatively safe for your right.

Speaker 3 (18:09):

Okay. So then let's take this a step further when it comes to kids. So I'm a big proponent of them not having their phones in their bedrooms and all of that. I mean, it's not even the, not just the phones, but like now we have like the Amazon echo devices that they have as their alarm clock in their bedroom and those type of things. So it's really about an awareness that, that does, Haveit something. And so maybe it needs to not be on their nightstand at night and maybe they need to not have it someplace <laugh> right. All of the time.

Speaker 4 (18:41):

Okay. So, uh, uh, let's chat a little bit about that. There is a federal communications commission standard. It was generated about 30 years ago, and it's describing what the power of a signal between a, a, a cell phone and a cell tower. So the federal government does define the standard. It was over 30 years ago, and I remind people over 30 years ago, if I had a cell phone, none of my friends had it. So I wasn't very much on it very, very often. So all the transmit power levels were, you know, at that time there wasn't much of it. So that standard sort of was okay, well, the standard was established by the FCC looking at six foot male military. And they established that if a signal penetrates one to two inches and it heated up less than two degrees, the power level would have to be no more than 1.6 Watts.

Speaker 4 (19:46):

Just remember 1.6 Watts. And, and so, and why heating <affirmative>? Well, the RF signal that you have from a cell phone is a microwave signal. You know, a microwave works at two, three gigahertz, and a cell phone is about one gigahertz. And when you put a piece of meat in the oven and the, and you turn the microwave on it, it heats up the water between the cells, the cells oscillate, they heat up and therefore cook. Well, that's what the standard prevents in theory, that it can only heat up more than two degrees because it's a thermal signal. Okay. How many people does that represent in our population? About 3%, we have smaller men, smaller women, young kids. They were never exposed to these kinds of things early on in their lives. And all of a sudden your children at six year old are getting a cell phone to call chat with grandma.

Speaker 4 (20:46):

And so the standard that was developed 30 years ago to protect the user represents protection for about 3% of the population. What does that mean? Well, again, the cell phone standard protects, uh, six foot male from one, two inches penetration into the head us year, old child. It goes completely through their head. There is no resistive path for that signal. Good. Remember it's not object signal. It's not just connecting to the cell tower. It's also going through your head. And so now you have a six foot child, a six, a six year old child. That's using a phone fairly regularly, unlike you and me when we were growing up and it's going completely through. So what's the implication. We really don't know cause phones have not been around that long at this kind of pervasive use. And so the standard is not been updated by the FCC.

Speaker 4 (21:43):

And it, it, there is a lot of Contra from the medical community and the FCC actually, to the extent, uh, Dolly, that they actually went to, uh, a court. They had an appeals court in Kennedy and, and Dr. Deborah Davis, a couple of scientists, they, they bought a court case to the FCC and the FCC see lost in court because they actually didn't evaluate modern science to understand where it really was and how much impact it really had on the human. So the FCCS been pushed back to look at it. So we know for sure, as I said, it represents 3% of the population, and we have a lot of I, a plethora, thousands and thousands and thousands of studies that show potential concerns. And so even the FCCS been pushed back to start looking at it. So for all of us, all of that means is you have to be aware of what you're using and, and how you're using it. And how much time are you using it and, and know your environment.

Speaker 3 (22:51):

Oh, very interesting. I mean like the gist of it is there are concerns. We don't know exactly what act, but for a small body and a small child, we know it's not a positive thing most likely. Right.

Speaker 4 (23:03):

And, and right. We, we don't know. Uh, I mean, honestly don't know, like we were talking about five to G you know, most of 5g is gonna be fine. It's sort of the same as everything, not fine. It's still the same as everything else has been for us, but the stuff in front of your house, that 23 gigahertz, if someone tells you a scientist tells you that it's dangerous, they don't know what they're talking about because there's no studies that characterize what the danger could be or not be. It's just different. If, if you are an informed researcher, you may think there could be comparisons to the current technologies being used to that new, but we really, as you just pointed out, we really don't know. And so that's where question becomes important. Right?

Speaker 3 (23:54):

So to then tell me what you have created with your company defender shield, as far as like what products you have and how that can help parents out there with devices.

Speaker 4 (24:04):

Well, I, I mentioned to you about my son's using a device. I created called a defender pad, and it's a bunch of shielding technologies. We put in into a platform to prevent the signals from passing from the device to the human. We have cell phones, shielding devices, we blankets, we have pregnancy, uh, protection. Why do I say pregnancy protection? There are some scientists that say when a, a young woman, 12 years old puts a, a cell phone in her back pocket, the signals strong enough to influence the egg, maybe potentially mutate the egg. And so when a child puts it and, and it, she becomes, uh, married. And once kids, there's a potential for that mutated today to be influenced in the child if a child's born. So there's that kind of concern. And that's why I begin looking for, we know from a study in San Francisco that at high levels of exposure to first trimesters, uh, you are three times more likely to miscarriage in that first trimester with those I elevating, uh, conditions.

Speaker 4 (25:20):

So you have to be aware of those. And that's why the, the protection for the, uh, for the, uh, pregnant woman, uh, we have pouches, we have, I have earbuds I'm using right now as we are chatting. And I actually created a, uh, a device in which I convert the, the electrical signal and I put it into, uh, an acoustical connection. So I have no emissions at all, uh, at the head level. So that was another one of the devices. Uh, we, we came up with that would, it's not much, let's put it this way. When you have a, a cell phone directly to your head, a as we we've talked about it, there's a potential that it can influence the frontal lobe cells. If you have it, one who feet away, 80% of that danger is gone by four foot, 98% is gone. So we have devices when you choose to pick something close to your body, but you don't need it close to your body.

Speaker 4 (26:21):

If you are taking a, a cell phone and you put it four foot or more away, a laptop, four foot, or more way, you are actually fairly safe. And, and it turns out that if you have a laptop, not in your lap, on your desk and you use to need the net connection to it, you really don't need any device protection, because all you're doing is moving that signal. That would be the wifi signal to the router, and you're eliminating it by connecting it. So there are ways of mitigating potential dangers by simply managing your environment. In fact, Dolly, I often talk about it as, uh, bees in the room. If you are aware of where the bees are, they're the transmitting power levels, and you begin turning them off or moving them away. You reduce exposure in general, one B won't kill you a thousand will.

Speaker 4 (27:15):

And all you have to do is think about where those bees are in the room and just turn 'em off and move 'em away. And you're pretty safe, very actually by simple management of your time. Another thing is, it's not just, um, the closeness, uh, how close you are to the device. It's how much you use the device. If you are using a, a device, a couple of minutes a day, a cell phone, till you had a couple minutes a day, it was unlikely that it'll ever impact you. If you are using it heavily more than an hour to two every day in 10 years, you are two to three times more likely to have frontal cancer, believe it or not. And so the duration of use of the technology is also important. So let me get back to other of things we have, we have blankets that are for, for moms that wanted actually, it was a baby blanket originally, but well, a lot of adults choose it, believe it or not. We have the earbuds adult headset, uh, headset to that are acoustical pouches, blankets, uh, devices that you can, we have a whole bunch of products, all designed to protect you. If you choose to have a device next close to your body for an extended period of

Speaker 3 (28:34):

Time. Okay. I love that kind of that summary in your, um, points about being four feet or more away connecting laptop to an ethernet cable and than the duration that you're using, the, the device, those are three really good things that parents can use as a strategy for mitigating the exposure. Right? Um, in addition to the tools that you, that

Speaker 4 (28:58):

Val, let's say, you're taking your child in a stroll, in a stroller, don't put your cell phone in the back of the divide of this stroller. That's close to your child's head. So keep it in your, not near your, your body, but in your, as a wallet or in, in your, anywhere other than the child's back. So that's a simple thing you can do and keep the child protected. And you still have the device available in, in, uh, to be used when you want to mm-hmm

Speaker 3 (29:29):

<affirmative>. So then you could also like your, like the pouches and things that you have, you could certainly use one of those.

Speaker 4 (29:37): Yeah. Right? Exactly.

Speaker 3 (29:38):

Exposure while you're on your walk, Dolly.

Speaker 4 (29:41):

We, we were talking, I just remembered there was some other question about sleep. You were talking about a, and so let's talk about that because that's important be because kids are going to bed with these, uh, I'll, I'll give an example, um, by telling you a story, I was on a, a podcast and I was talking to this person, very, very bright person. And I said, your bedroom's a sanctuary. There should be no transmitting signals in that room. Uh, all devices, even in, in the case of a cell phone, I, I don't even recommend you've put it four foot or more way, get it out of the room. You don't need it in that room, eliminate all those kinds of things. And the person was very nice. And, uh, she said, well, you know, like that's good coaching. Uh, I'm, I'm sure that, uh, my husband and I, we have our phones in our room.

Speaker 4 (30:38):

And, well, thank you so much for letting us know about three or four weeks later, she calls me up and she said, I didn't believe a word. You said the way she would describe me. She says, I didn't believe a word you said. And I said it in the RF signal influences the head. It influences the sleep. Um, and so like, you have to get in the pattern, taking these things outta your room, because it disrupts the, my, uh, the, uh, me toin that's being generated throughout the body. And she said, my husband and I are now sleeping throughout the night. We simply took the laptops. Or in fact there was the phones out of our rooms. The other dimension of that discussion I had with her was simple. When you look at a, um, a lap, a laptop or, or tablet, when you're sleeping, before you go into bed at night, there is a blue light.

Speaker 4 (31:26):

You may have heard of this Dolly, a blue light blue light is part of the spectrum of sunlight, right? It's it's believe it or not visible electromagnetic radiation. That's what it is. It's visible. The blue component is very high on the spectrum of light and very, very close to what what's known as ionized radiation, x-ray radiation. That's roughly where it is. And it is the part of light that actually helps you go to sleep or stay awake. In other words, blue light is the trigger in the back of the eye. The crypto pro is a protein in the back of the eye that turns the on and off switch for a melatonin. And so when you are looking at the screen at 11 o'clock at night, and you've decided to go to bed, the melatonin hasn't been turned on because you had the blue light penetrating your eye and the switch hasn't turned off.

Speaker 4 (32:26):

And so believe it or not, it disrupts the, the, uh, the pattern of sleep only because it delays the melatonin and, and, and the, and the potential, uh, deep sleep and everything. The, the sick nature of our 24 hour cycle. Is it being impacted when you are actually looking at that blue light at night, before you go to bed? So it's a combination of removing products and watching how the technology you're using is impacting, uh, the, the sleep pattern and other ways. Um, so it is a, it is no question, very important for sleep that you really pull tablets, laptops, cell phones out of your sleeping area. Particularly if it's close to you, you do not wanna do it. Cause it is disrupting your sleep pattern.

Speaker 3 (33:17):

So will the, you have like think guys saw him on your website, the blue blocker glasses. Oh

Speaker 4 (33:21):

Yes. Did they actually, yeah, actually, that's why I did it because people were like, during the day, you're not gonna not use a screen. And it is only the blue component of the signal of the, of the light that you're worried about. So we have filters that we put on that takes that signal out, and we have a light 50% shielding and another one that's 99% shielding. And that's why we did it because people who want to read at night, they can go with the, the shield 99% shielding, and they actually have no impact to sleeping pattern as a result

Speaker 3 (34:01):

Of that. Okay. So then that would be a good alternative if they need

Speaker 4 (34:05):

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. If you wanna do it, you can take that precautionary measure.

Speaker 3 (34:10):

Okay, cool. The other thing I wanted to go back to was on the earbuds. So kids are, you know, like all crazy about their AirPods and things like that. Is there anything that can be put on AirPods specific that helps to block it? Or is it just kind of a lost cause with those

Speaker 4 (34:24):

<laugh> the, the answer is no, but, but let's talk about it because this is pretty serious, in my opinion. And I, I hate to talk about this detail, but, um, a, a cell phone, as I mentioned is 1.6 Watts per kilogram. That's the maximum amount of power, a Bluetooth signal, which is used to communicate to the earbuds is dot three Watts. It's five times less, the power level, five times less, the power level. So it's safer to some extent, but not necessarily the safest. And the reason why is because you have Bluetooth is a signal that goes from the, the device, your cell phone to the earbud. And then many of these devices communicate between each other with Bluetooth. And it turns out that.one.one, watch 15 times the power level of a cell phone can influence the frontal lobe cell and mutate the cell. It's not like it's not completely safe. It is from science. We have some data, not that much, but some data has indicated that kind of potential danger and have identified.one Watts as all it takes, which is really not much power at all. So in my opinion, dot dot, you do not want to use those devices. Uh, you, you just yourself needlessly. And if you had a standard peer earbuds, that's fine. Would that a wire, if you wanna do an improvement to that use acoustical connections like I designed and also was all in a market, other places.

Speaker 3 (36:14):

Okay. Yeah, that was gonna be, my next question was the difference between the wired ones and the wireless ones, cuz like all of the iPhones. Now you have to use an adapter in order to use the wire ones cuz they don't have a Jack anymore. <laugh>

Speaker 4 (36:28):

I know it's like crazy. It was good for business, I guess,

Speaker 3 (36:31):

I guess so. I mean I have my own pair of AirPods that I bought years ago before I realized that as any, I just didn't really, you know, it was always kind of like one of those things like surely they're protecting us and wouldn't put something out that's gonna cause this harm. But it's, it's clear that there is exposure there and every kid ha seems to have those in their ears when they're walking around. So

Speaker 4 (36:53):

Dolly actually you bring up a really good point. One of the things I always say is you have the architect and you, your own destiny, you can't rely on anyone to keep you protected the FCC. They didn't intentionally. They certainly did not intend to create a standard that was 30 years later. Not as protective as it should be. They didn't do that. But that's a consequence when, when I smoked cigarettes 12, when I was 12 years old, many, many, many years ago, you know, I, I was a big man and believe it or not, even back then science knew about the link between cancer and smokey. How many years later did it take for us all to know that you shouldn't smoke over 30, 40 years ago, right? Trans fats, you know, there was a lowly biochemist 30 years ago. He said, it's not the cholesterol in the eggs that are killing us. It's the trans fats were used in the Cookoff French fries. It's Cogenic and how many years did it take for that to be banned it band in the us now it's been that way for two years, but we knew 30 years ago that it was potentially dangerous from a science perspective. I don't see this as that much different. It's a technology that we created in our environment, which is really, really good for us in so many different ways. It, it changes our lives, but it also introduces the concerns that we should be thinking about.

Speaker 3 (38:22):

Right. So cigarettes are a prime example of that and they're still out on the market, even though we know that you're right,

Speaker 4 (38:27):

Exactly. It's obviously I don't smoke anymore. I haven't for 40 years. So

Speaker 3 (38:34):

Yeah. So, okay. So I think you have given some really, really valuable tips on navigating this because technology's not going away. There's advantages to it. Like we're here connected right now because of it. So I think this is really good starting point for parents to just be aware of this and to help try to mitigate the risk of the exposure because you know, we're not gonna get the devices out of these kids' hands and no,

Speaker 4 (38:59):

No. Hey Ali, in fact, you reminded me when you mentioned that when we had the defendant pad, I wasn't really thinking we're gonna create other product lines. And then I read an article one day that these parents bought a, uh, their six year old daughter, a cell phone. She kept on pushing, pushing, pushing. And a year later after they got her, she, she passed away from, uh, front lo cancers. And I said to myself, I know I can stop that signal. I did it with the defender head and I said, look, we're not gonna throw away our technology, but we have to find a way of maybe making it slightly safer if you think it's endangering. And that's when I adopted the technology from one device to another simply because I'm not gonna throw my cell phone away. But at that time, believe it or not, I never had a cell phone close to me. I was just, I never did. But now I will, because I know I'm protected with a shielding device. So if you're gonna use it, watch your time, your distance and duration, uh, as well as the shielding, uh, if, if you choose to have devices long, extended period of times, close to your body. Awesome.

Speaker 3 (40:13):

Thank you so much for spending the time with me today. That's the, the, you just summarized it all with time, distance, duration and shielding. So yeah. Yep. Um, I really, really appreciate your time and your expertise and really taking the time to explain all this. And I think that all of the parents out there are really gonna benefit from this. So thank you so much for putting your passion into something that can help people. Well,

Speaker 4 (40:35):

Thanks so much daddy for invite. I mean, I, I really did enjoy this. I always, I, I think our goal in life is to try to help people understand what decisions they need to come up with. And, and that's what I consider pretty important for us to do so. And I think you do as well. So thank you so much for the work you do as well.

Speaker 3 (40:55):

Yes. You're welcome. Thank you so much. We just have to kind of join hands and, and move forward and, and create your own destiny like you said, so. Yep.

Speaker 4 (41:03):

Yeah. Whether you we're architects of the, our own destiny, don't let wait for anyone else to help you.

Exactly.

Speaker 3 (41:11):

All right. Thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (41:15):

Thanks for tuning in being that mom is isn't easy, but together we can be that mom strong. Don't forget to leave a review, connect on social and join Dolly's free community till next time.

Speaker 3 (41:28):

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